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Pirate Motherships - Need NERFBAT soon(tm) ?

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welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.01.30 16:07:00 - [1] Edited by: welsh wizard on 30/01/2007 16:07:25 Agree completely tiller. Motherships and Titans need a warp strength, say 10-12 for mofos and 18-20 for titans. The numbers are obviously open to debate but otherwise, problem solved. Originally by: DeckardIRL Funniest thread of the day. All this coming from a pirate. Deck This may come as something of a revelation to you Deckard but some people actually prefer an enjoyable balanced game despite their background. Winning at all costs isn't on everyones agenda.
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.01.30 19:50:00 - [2] Originally by: Davlin Lotze Originally by: welsh wizard Edited by: welsh wizard on 30/01/2007 16:25:41 Edited by: welsh wizard on 30/01/2007 16:19:50 Agree completely tiller. Motherships and Titans need a warp strength, say 10-12 for mofos and 18-20 for titans. edit: I've seen some suggestions along the line of 50 points required to scramble a mothership. Think for a second what that actually means, that means that if for whatever reason 1 or 2 points dropped then only 49 points would be on it and BOOM off it goes in warp. Think about the course of an average battle, I'd estimate that to keep 50 points on one ship is going to require a fleet of at least 2 times the required number of points, so 100 ships, all fitted with with a scrambler. By this time the matter has become largely irrelevant anyway, a Blob of support like that is almost impossible to amass along with firepower for anyone but the very largest of corps/alliances. Now factor in planning for these ops, not really possible is it? You can't rely on the mothership to be sat in the right place at the right time so your 150 man blob can descend on them without being scouted and/or crashing the system. No more than 20 points should be required in my opinion. As you said yourself tiller, isk should not be the sole factor in deciding whether or not a ship is practically invulnerable. edit edit: Another viable solution is capital level warp scramblers, make the ship vulnerable but only if the opposition are willing to put billions of isk on the line also. Originally by: DeckardIRL Funniest thread of the day. All this coming from a pirate. Deck This may come as something of a revelation to you Deckard but some people actually prefer an enjoyable balanced game despite their background. Winning at all costs isn't on everyones agenda. So 4 6pt minnie ceptors and you're golden right? To kill a 25billion isk ship?????? Why not spend your time in figuring out how to kill 23 fighters in two\three minutes? Nullify me. How many people could repeatedly take a roughly 450 million isk loss in fighters\drones in a single engagement? I can think of any number of ways to *****the fighters a mom would pop out. But I'm not going to do your thinking for you. Smartbombs tend to make short work of Stilletos with 7.5km scrams.
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.02.01 15:00:00 - [3] Originally by: DeckardIRL Originally by: welsh wizard This may come as something of a revelation to you Deckard but some people actually prefer an enjoyable balanced game despite their background. Winning at all costs isn't on everyones agenda. You are clearly missing the point . This is a 25Bn (Billion) isk ship. And numpties are suggesting putting scramb points on it ... What if Miz fielded 18 Dreads instead for the same isk to go piewat with his corp mates.... whats Nerfs would be called for then as a crew that large would be just as invincible? Like I said pointless thread. Want to kill him, then you will need to field an equivalent amount of isk on the same grid (thats balanced).... you have the cahonas for that? He clearly does.... Peeps looking easy mode again . Please remember I am NOT defending him but the ship. Deck 18 dreads are significantly easier to combat in empire than 1 mothership. You think isk equates to low risk pvp, it shouldn't. You want to fly the ship? Fine, but you accept the risk that goes with using it, just as a 2 week old character with a shiny Caracal does. Money isn't everything.
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.02.01 15:00:00 - [4] Originally by: DeckardIRL Originally by: welsh wizard This may come as something of a revelation to you Deckard but some people actually prefer an enjoyable balanced game despite their background. Winning at all costs isn't on everyones agenda. You are clearly missing the point . This is a 25Bn (Billion) isk ship. And numpties are suggesting putting scramb points on it ... What if Miz fielded 18 Dreads instead for the same isk to go piewat with his corp mates.... whats Nerfs would be called for then as a crew that large would be just as invincible? Like I said pointless thread. Want to kill him, then you will need to field an equivalent amount of isk on the same grid (thats balanced).... you have the cahonas for that? He clearly does.... Peeps looking easy mode again . Please remember I am NOT defending him but the ship. Deck 18 dreads are significantly easier to combat in empire than 1 mothership. You think isk equates to low risk pvp, it shouldn't. You want to fly the ship? Fine, but you accept the risk that goes with using it, just as a 2 week old character with a shiny Caracal does. Money isn't everything.
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.02.03 14:45:00 - [5] Tbh kublai your viewpoint is just a little too comfortable to be debating this. You're arguing it so fervently because you want your sensor boosted monster to continue ganking battleships by the hundreds at some low-sec chokepoint. If you'd step away from the bias just a little you may realise that there is no hope of removing said ship from that gate unless it chooses to leave. That ship, when in empire goes where it pleases, kill what it pleases and there is no price to pay. Lost fighters? Hah! This game isn't about material loss its about overcoming your opponent and basking in the knwledge that you've set about their demise. That ship ignores these points, goes where it wants, does what it pleases and doesn't pay the price. It has to change.
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.02.03 23:06:00 - [6] Edited by: welsh wizard on 03/02/2007 23:02:35 Originally by: Davlin Lotze Originally by: welsh wizard Tbh kublai your viewpoint is just a little too comfortable to be debating this. You're arguing it so fervently because you want your sensor boosted monster to continue ganking battleships by the hundreds at some low-sec chokepoint. If you'd step away from the bias just a little you may realise that there is no hope of removing said ship from that gate unless it chooses to leave. That ship, when in empire goes where it pleases, kill what it pleases and there is no price to pay. Lost fighters? Hah! This game isn't about material loss its about overcoming your opponent and basking in the knwledge that you've set about their demise. That ship ignores these points, goes where it wants, does what it pleases and doesn't pay the price. It has to change. You fail in this thread because you want things balanced with the "trophy" momship killmail as the standard. It is NOT the appropriate standard for reasons stated in this thread many times. In fact, NOTHING has to change. Ask MC or MM if they think things should change. Were their recent fights involving moms lacking in any way? Indeed it was the MC mom that had to leave the field and jump out if memory serves after losing two regular carriers. Fleeing the field is hardly the role of the overpowered zomg pwnmobile. Your pursuit of the holy grail of the momship killmail is blinding you to reason. 8-( So in all honesty you completely support the role a mothership plays in low-sec? Some people sit on a low sec gate all day killing ship after ship after ship without having to worry at all, and this is going to become more and more common. If you think 25 billion isk should buy you that luxury than I say you're the one "blinded to reason". Wake up.
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.02.04 12:59:00 - [7] Originally by: Gix Firebrand Originally by: Dr Slice Originally by: kublai Originally by: tiller Originally by: kublai Could you READ what I write before responding? I really don't think a man who brags about logging to save his pod should complain about OTHERS being allegidly invunerable. Sorry no :-)) Well tiller, since you admittely don't actually argue what I say, rather than arguing my nick, i'll ignore you as i'm debating something here, when you wanto utalize actuall arguments and read before replying and all that stuff, then perhaps we can talk. Until then, I suggest you stop spamming posts. Kublai, you must have realized by now that most of the people in this forum know that you flame alot, and throw alot of insults mixed with hostility in your posts. And most of them take what you say with a grain of salt. Or is this phenomenon not sinking into your head yet? The same could be said of Tiller and his attention whoring. I was just thinking the complete opposite. 99% of people taking as much abuse as he is right now would have lost it and started ranting. He takes your crap on the chin.
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.02.05 19:21:00 - [8] Edited by: welsh wizard on 05/02/2007 19:27:08 kublai for king of reason! but ye kublai is right.. they are fine atm Hah! He wants a ship that doesn't die. If not concentrated scrambling to hold them down then capital ship level scramblers. Anything to make killing them in low-sec possible. Do you in all honestly, think someone will lose a mothership in low-sec with current mechanics? Can you see it from that point of view? If someone does lose one then I'll apologise officially. It's not nice to see people screaming for your ship of choice' blood but its only going to get worse. Why? Because more and more motherships are going to be ganking defenceless people in low-sec and they'll have no chance of returning the favour. You honestly think Eve players are going to stand for that for any length of time? Anyway this has become akin to headbutting a wall so I'll just let time do the healing. I'm confident the problem will become evident a few months down the line.
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.02.06 02:10:00 - [9] Excellent post Davlin! I just think practically immune, remote sensor boosted motherships sat on low-sec choke points farming passers by is a step in the wrong direction for this game. I think the prospect of trying to kill one in empire is essentially hopeless. I think Eve players will just start to avoid them and find a way round rather than trying to kill them. As they become more and more common in empire with pirate corps owning 4 or 5 we'll see low-sec stagnate further. Gangs of indestructable pirate capital ships floating about doing as they please with no real fears. I understand your points about losing lots of isks worth of fighters but I don't play this game to inflict financial damage on people. I play it to reap the satisfaction that is destroying their ship and sometimes their pod. You're a pvp'er yourself, can you honestly say that destroying a carriers fighters is as satisfying as blowing up a battleship? Isk just doesn't come into it as far as I'm concerned. When a player is introduced to pvp for the first time they learn that the single most important thing to do is fit a scrambler. You don't kill anything unless you can make it stay. This ideology seems to have flown out the window with the introduction of motherships to low-sec. In theory they can be destroyed in empire but as far as I'm concerned it's putting a price on immortality. It's early days, I guess we'll just have to see what happens. I don't see how further argument will change anything or convince either party otherwise. I will comment no further on the matter.
welsh wizard 0utbreak	Posted - 2007.02.06 11:26:00 - [10] Originally by: Sentri Gun Its a crazy expensive ship I don't think the players of eve really need to worry about an epidemic of solo mothership pvpers. Ok just one more comment :P Thats the other problem, the isk has devalued so drastically that actually 25billion isn't that much. Theres probably 100+ players out there who could afford their own titan if someone were to build it for them.

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